Silly question?

[jacobdahl]

I feel sort of dumb asking this, but here goes... Before my recent FZ6 R purchase, the only motorcycle experience I had was in motocross. On my old dirt bike, I was always taught that the clutch is for starts only. When riding my new street bike, I have been trying different clutch/shift techniques, and would really like some insight on what the accepted practice is. Will no clutch shifting damage my bike? Will using the clutch on every shift unnecessarily wear my clutch?

[toofless]

Originally Posted by jacobdahl

I feel sort of dumb asking this, but here goes... Before my recent FZ6 R purchase, the only motorcycle experience I had was in motocross. On my old dirt bike, I was always taught that the clutch is for starts only. When riding my new street bike, I have been trying different clutch/shift techniques, and would really like some insight on what the accepted practice is. Will no clutch shifting damage my bike? Will using the clutch on every shift unnecessarily wear my clutch?

i dont think its a silly question, but if it is, at least you're not the only one asking...
Shifting Without The Cluth AKA SpeedShifting

[MikeN02]

Originally Posted by jacobdahl

I feel sort of dumb asking this, but here goes... Before my recent FZ6 R purchase, the only motorcycle experience I had was in motocross. On my old dirt bike, I was always taught that the clutch is for starts only. When riding my new street bike, I have been trying different clutch/shift techniques, and would really like some insight on what the accepted practice is. Will no clutch shifting damage my bike? Will using the clutch on every shift unnecessarily wear my clutch?

Shifting without a clutch wears it down faster than using the clutch. As you've mentioned it's a street bike, therefore use the clutch. People who race on the track don't use the clutch because... they're racing and they have the money to replace their bike when it wears out.

I think it costs something about $200 to replace it when it's worn out, so I'd start using the clutch!

[JonKerr]

Power shifting is fine if it's done right. It's not easy to do on our bike. You have to be in just the right RPM range and crack the throttle just the right amount. Much easier to just grab the clutch. I've done it before and had it work. I've also tried it and had it either just not shift but also had it grab really suddenly once. It felt like it was going to kick me off the back of the bike. I don't bother with it anymore. Doesn't take much effort to just use the clutch like you should and not take the chance wearing things out. I never used the clutch either the handful of times I rode a dirt bike. For some reason it was just smoother on the dirtbike than on the sportbike. But shifting using the clutch is smoother than on the dirt bike when using the clutch for some odd reason.

[streetmaster]

Could be the helical cut on the gears on a dirtbike that allows it to shift easier.
Different transmissions for different uses.
My V Star is near impossible to clutchless shift.

[husker525]

Motorcycle transmission gears are a constant mesh design, with some being a helical cut on the gears as mentioned. I have both a dirt and a street background, so let me try and explain a few things:

1. You can shift without a clutch on the dirt, as long as you decrease the engine load on the transmission by momentarily letting off the throttle, which reduces the shock load on the shift forks and gears. The coefficient of friction or (traction) on the dirt will always be lower than that of the pavement. This means that some of the potential shock to the transmission is dissipated through the tire sliding on the dirt.

2. On a street bike, with a higher coefficient of friction of the roadway surface, and the soft tire compound, the shock to the transmission on a clutchless shift is higher. This is more apparent on a downshift than an upshift. In theory, and some applications, it can be done, but everything must be done perfectly. You will not wear out a clutch faster doing clutchless shifts, you are bypassing the clutch, so all the wear goes directly to the transmission components.

Even just bumping the clutch lever during shifts helps reduce the shock to the transmission. IMO only, I would much rather replace a $200 clutch, than to have to replace tranny parts, and when a tranny grenades, it can lead to much more catastrophic internal damage.

The time savings in shifting without a clutch is negligible over shifting with a clutch, with a little practice. Drag racers use air shifters or electronic shifters that interupt the engine rpm's at the shift point, which is the same as letting off the throttle or engaging the clutch.

In essence, can you do it? Yes. Is is worth it? You decide.

[Superfly]

I clutchless shift for upshifts probably about 50% of the time especially from 2nd gear up. 1st to 2nd is a bigger jump in ratio and it clunks harder for me so I clutch that one. The 2-3 3-4 are nice and the 4-5 5-6 are almost too smooth. Best around 7000rpm...

If I'm just puttering around I'll use the clutch and always for downshifting. I've tried clutchless downshifting but you can really screw that up and jolt the bike if you dont get the throttle correct. Up shifting is super easy.

To try - put the bike in 4th gear and slowly accelerate to 6000-7000rpm. As you apply pressure on the shifter upwards slightly reduce the throttle and the gear will slide into place. Then you can go back on to the same throttle position. Its so easy youre going to laugh the first time you do it.

I dont pre-load the shifter anymore. I'm just shifting and throttling at the same time...I've done countless full throttle runs from around 30km/hr in 2nd to 170km/hr in 6th all without the clutch. I just love it

I'm not doing this to save clutch wear btw. I just think its smoother and also when riding hard I like to hang on to the bars with both hands...

lots of people will tell you that its hard on the gearbox...I thought so too...then I read this:

Clutchless Shifting - Sport Rider Magazine Online

[Fogride]

If you have a hard rev limit it will cut the power enough to up shift. I haven't done it yet on this bike because of the break in miles but it's the quick way to go.

[Halon]

Most of my driving is basic commuter driving so maybe it's different but in my experience it just seems like the clutch lever is right there, so why put extra strain on the bike? I'd rather spend more time driving than repairing. Just my .02

[2w05thletes]

Originally Posted by Superfly

I clutchless shift for upshifts probably about 50% of the time especially from 2nd gear up. 1st to 2nd is a bigger jump in ratio and it clunks harder for me so I clutch that one. The 2-3 3-4 are nice and the 4-5 5-6 are almost too smooth. Best around 7000rpm...

If I'm just puttering around I'll use the clutch and always for downshifting. I've tried clutchless downshifting but you can really screw that up and jolt the bike if you dont get the throttle correct. Up shifting is super easy.

To try - put the bike in 4th gear and slowly accelerate to 6000-7000rpm. As you apply pressure on the shifter upwards slightly reduce the throttle and the gear will slide into place. Then you can go back on to the same throttle position. Its so easy youre going to laugh the first time you do it.

I dont pre-load the shifter anymore. I'm just shifting and throttling at the same time...I've done countless full throttle runs from around 30km/hr in 2nd to 170km/hr in 6th all without the clutch. I just love it

I'm not doing this to save clutch wear btw. I just think its smoother and also when riding hard I like to hang on to the bars with both hands...

lots of people will tell you that its hard on the gearbox...I thought so too...then I read this:

Clutchless Shifting - Sport Rider Magazine Online

You're right, surprisingly easy and smooth. Tried it today. Still not sold on not using the clutch for everyday riding though. To each his own, thanks for the tip though!